Not that again

In the effort to avoid any more rehashing of old arguments than necessary, I’ll just say this simply: from a personal defense standpoint when using a pistol in a service caliber such as 9mm, .40 S&W, or .45 ACP all modern hollowpoint ammo regardless of grain weight and velocity such as Winchester Ranger, Golden Saber, Speer Gold Dots, et al is designed to meet or exceed the FBI penetration standards.  So my 147 grain 9mm is going to penetrate 12+ inches of ballistic gelatin after defeating common barrier materials and still give reliable expansion.  Same as your .40, or your .45, or your 9mm in a different bullet weight.

I’m begging you people, please stop all the caliber wars.  Can’t we just get a long gun?


  1. Then there’s the 10mm, which penetrates 24″ of ballistic gelatin, 3″ hardened steel plates, 4 to 5 school buses, and reaches escape velocity so it can orbit the Earth once or twice before doing it all again.

  2. “But we can all admit .25 ACP sucks, right?”

    Yes, but such comments must be postscripted with the phrases “still better than throwing rocks” and “better a .25 in your pocket than a *preferred caliber left at home.”

  3. I’ve noticed that folks who rely on G-d’s own caliber (.45 ACP for you heathens) never have to make these arguments…

  4. Hence why there’s a .25 ACP in my pocket right now. It’s certainly not my first choice for shooting fools, but 1) I don’t see people volunteering to take a .25 ACP Gold Dot in the fleshy bits, and 2) I can conceal this thing anywhere there isn’t a metal detector.

    It’s like Tam said – pants go on, gun goes in them. It’s always loaded and ready to go, no matter what.

    Which sort of reminds me that I need to buy some .25 Auto FMJ and do some serious shooting with this.

  5. I’m inclined to believe the decline in caliber based “debate” is tied to the current abundance (or lack there of ) of ammunition.

  6. A lottle off-topic (pun intended), but interesting:

    I surf’d by today to just read about the H&K (they hate you, Btw…) torture test and they had an entry about practicing “unfun stuff”, which neatly parallels your 8/4 entry…

    It is here for folks interested –


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